Well, That Sucked... Let's Look Ahead to 2010

**maurice** · 09-01-2009 12:06 PM

To be clear, I'm not necessarily saying what KW should do. I'm guessing what he'll actually do.

I'ma assume that AJ, Bonerko, Ramirez, Bacon, Rios, and TCQ will all be back in their current roles, and that Dye, Pods, and Fields will be gone. Flowers can work in at DH and C. None of the other position prospects will be ready to break camp with the big league team. Castro, Kotsay, Getz, and/or Nix might stick around. Wise can go the way of his predecessor, Timo Perez.

As for the pitching, your top 4 is set with Buehrle, Peavy, Danks, and Floyd. Hudson, Torres, and whoever can fight it out for the 5th spot. Even assuming that Dotel is gone, most of the pen probably is set, since it's not really feasible to restructure through trades at this late juncture.

That leaves KW with a boatload of money to fill the following holes: - a 2B who can leadoff (Brian Roberts?) - a second lefty in the pen - a lefthanded hitting corner OF with pop - backup CF / defensive replacement / pinch runner - backup SS / pinch runner

If JR decides to be extremely cheap, the 1st 2 spots can be filled internally with Getz/Nix and Williams. The last 2 spots also can be filled very cheaply, but they absolutely need to spend some money to fill Thome's role in the lineup, upgrading to somebody who can play the field and DH only some of the time. Pods ain't gonna hack it.

Theoretical Roster: C - Pierzynski, Flowers, Castro 1B - Konerko, Kotsay 2B - ______ (trade, Getz, Nix) SS - Ramirez, ______ (free agent) 3B - Bechham CF - Rios, ______ (free agent) RF - Quentin LF - ______ (trade, free agent) DH - rotation

SP - Buehrle, Peavy, Danks, Floyd, (Hudson, Torres, etc.) RP - Jenks, Thornton, Linebrink, Pena, Carrassco, ______ (Williams, trade, free agent)

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:08 PM

I don't think Kotsay stays.

I also think Thome comes back on the cheap.

**spiffie** · 09-01-2009 12:10 PM

I think that is part of the rationale for the trade. Thome gets to go spend a month in LA and try to earn a ring, then if the Sox want to bring him back for say 2 years/8 million total or so, they can do so without the hurdles of arbitration or what you can sign your own FA's to contract-wise.

**maurice** · 09-01-2009 12:11 PM

The more I think about this, the more I believe that the Sox are screwed if they bring Thome back.

It greatly limits their ability to (1) improve much and (2) work Flowers into the lineup.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by spiffie

I think that is part of the rationale for the trade. Thome gets to go spend a month in LA and try to earn a ring, then if the Sox want to bring him back for say 2 years/8 million total or so, they can do so without the hurdles of arbitration or what you can sign your own FA's to contract-wise.

I'm thinking the same thing. They moved him to:

a) shed a little payroll this year (but the cash to LA probably makes that amount somewhat negligible)

b) give Thome a shot at a ring

c) give them more flexibility to sign him as a FA without going to arb.

I wonder if part of the terms with LA was that they couldn't offer him arb.

**maurice** · 09-01-2009 12:13 PM

LA might be scared to offer arb. The outside chance that he accepts would leave them with a very expensive DH--not particularly useful in the NL.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by maurice

The more I think about this, the more I believe that the Sox are screwed if they bring Thome back.

It greatly limits their ability to (1) improve much and (2) work Flowers into the lineup.

Thome would be a great bench player for the Sox. I could see it working out if he played 2-3 games a week against RHP only.

Of course, Ozzie is bound to start him every day if he were on the roster.

***Zoso*** · 09-01-2009 12:15 PM

I think they'll bring Pods back but best-case as a straight backup, and worst-case as the LF. I'd like him to be a pinch hitter and a pinch runner. He's not a great stealer, but he gives you 1st to 3rd speed off the bench which is important. And you have to admit he's a pretty clutch hitter.

I can guarantee they'll try to get Figgins too. It would solve 3B and 2B if they did.

**rustysurf83** · 09-01-2009 12:19 PM

Has Flowers had any time at 1b?

**FedEx227** · 09-01-2009 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by SABRSox

Thome would be a great bench player for the Sox. I could see it working out if he played 2-3 games a week against RHP only.

Of course, Ozzie is bound to start him every day if he were on the roster.

That's why I don't want the Sox to get him because they won't be able to handle not playing a "class act" everyday.

I want us to move on, give Flowers a chance or give Viciedo a run. Thome would be a great bench player but you and I and every Sox fan in the world knows you can't give Ozzie nice things.

**chisoxmike** · 09-01-2009 12:22 PM

I think they'll try and get Beltre/Figgins for 3B. Move Beckham to SS, Ramirez to 2B. Konerko for 1B.

I don't see Nix, Wise or Pods back.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:23 PM

I don't think Viciedo will be ready next year.

I also think trading Josh Fields to be a huge mistake at this point. Yeah, Figgins would make sense for us, but he'll be expensive and he'll cost us a draft pick, so I'm not terribly excited about that.

Fields can hit. He can't field, but he can hit, and he's cheap. I think we can deal with the poor defense at 3B for his bat, at least until Konerko is gone, and then we can move Fields over to 1B.

**samram** · 09-01-2009 12:23 PM

Right now, the Sox have the 18th best record in MLB, so I think they can sign a FA without losing a 1st rounder. Hopefully that doesn't change.

I think we've seen the "veteran meant to play 3 times a week ends up starting" story enough with Ozzie. They are going to have to find left handed power from somewhere. Hideki Matsui?

**Mega** · 09-01-2009 12:23 PM

I seriously doubt Ozzie moves Ramirez out of the SS position. The dude messes up and Ozzie laughs about it.

**FedEx227** · 09-01-2009 12:24 PM

How pathetic is it that we have to plan AROUND our dumbass managers stupid ass decision to play favorites.

Fucking pathetic.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:25 PM

Our dumbass manager certainly makes you want to give him a shitty bench so he has to play the guys you want him to play.

**samram** · 09-01-2009 12:25 PM

I hope KW talks to Orlando Hudson about playing 2B. He can hit 1st or 2nd and is a great defender. The team has to catch the ball next year.

***Zoso*** · 09-01-2009 12:26 PM

Originally Posted by chisoxmike

I think they'll try and get Beltre/Figgins for 3B. Move Beckham to SS, Ramirez to 2B. Konerko for 1B.

I don't see Nix, Wise or Pods back.

I like Getz as a backup. He's serviceable starter quality on a mediocre team. That equals a great backup on a good team. Same with Pods really.

Nix has a ton of power. He should've stayed in Colorado.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:26 PM

I think LA will re-sign Hudson. He's quite popular here.

**Mega** · 09-01-2009 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by SABRSox

Our dumbass manager certainly makes you want to give him a shitty bench so he has to play the guys you want him to play.

Even that doesn't always work with this team. Wise was starting a bunch.

**samram** · 09-01-2009 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by Zoso

I like Getz as a backup. He's serviceable starter quality on a mediocre team. That equals a great backup on a good team. Same with Pods really.

Nix has a ton of power. He should've stayed in Colorado.

I don't think Getz can be a backup because he doesn't play SS or 3B and he sucks defensively.

**FedEx227** · 09-01-2009 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by Zoso

I like Getz as a backup. He's serviceable starter quality on a mediocre team. That equals a great backup on a good team. Same with Pods really.

Nix has a ton of power. He should've stayed in Colorado.

Ozzie won't put Getz as a backup if he has both Nix and Getz.

Pods would likely play way too much as well.

**maurice** · 09-01-2009 12:28 PM

Thanks y'all for demonstrating why I wrote the 1st line in the 1st post. We can talk all day about what KW and Ozzie ought to do, but that shit might as well go in "Take my Konerko, please?"

I'm 99% positive that Konerko will be at 1B, Ramirez will be at SS, Fields will not be on the Sox 25-man, and Ozzie will find some way to overplay both the oldest guy and the worst guy on the roster.

**FedEx227** · 09-01-2009 12:29 PM

Yup. Exactly.

Your 2010 Chicago White Sox

1B- Konerko
2B- Getz
SS- Ramirez
3B- Beckham
DH- Thome
CF- Rios
LF- Pods
RF- TCQ

At least that's my prediction.

**chisoxmike** · 09-01-2009 12:29 PM

One thing is for sure, KW will not get into bidding wars. That's why it's going to be hard for them to get a guy like Hudson or Figgins.

It wouldn't be surprised if none of the FAs on the market that could help the Sox, actually be in a White Sox uniform in 2010. Maybe they get one. If anything, they'll throw money around for the bullpen if they unload Linebrink or Dotel.

Maurice's first post is pretty realistic is what the 2010 team is probably going to shape up to.

**Sydney Bristow** · 09-01-2009 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by FedEx227

Yup. Exactly.

Your 2010 Chicago White Sox

1B- Konerko
2B- Getz
SS- Ramirez
3B- Beckham
DH- Thome
CF- Rios
LF- Pods
RF- TCQ

At least that's my prediction.

I think Wise is starting, probably over Rios. Wise will have a .260 Sept and will prove Ozzie right. =)

**samram** · 09-01-2009 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by SABRSox

I think LA will re-sign Hudson. He's quite popular here.

I guess if they want to be cheap, they could sign Iwamura to play 2B. Pretty good OBP, decent speed. He's average defensively.

**chisoxmike** · 09-01-2009 12:32 PM

Hawk could blow his load if the Sox got Iwamura.

**chops** · 09-01-2009 12:32 PM

I want to see no part of Pods in 2010.

I've stated before, if he's here I'm pulling for the TWINS.

**BTrain929** · 09-01-2009 12:33 PM

Most of our boatload of money went to Rios and Peavy.

**FedEx227** · 09-01-2009 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by chips

I want to see no part of Pods in 2010.

I've stated before, if he's here I'm pulling for the TWINS.

I'm fairly certain he'll be back

**maurice** · 09-01-2009 12:35 PM

Let me take a step back. KW has been hinting for weeks that the lineup is going to be re-worked if they don't make the playoffs. Well, they ain't gonna make the playoffs. So the question is, which positions get reworked?

Given what we know about KW and Ozzie, the only plausible candidates I see are DH, 2B, and the corner OF spot not occupied by TCQ. Also, assuming that AJ stays, KW is going to want to give Flowers more than backup ABs, which pretty much requires them to stay flexible at DH.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by maurice

Thanks y'all for demonstrating why I wrote the 1st line in the 1st post. We can talk all day about what KW and Ozzie ought to do, but that shit might as well go in "Take my Konerko, please?"

I'm 99% positive that Konerko will be at 1B, Ramirez will be at SS, Fields will not be on the Sox 25-man, and Ozzie will find some way to overplay both the oldest guy and the worst guy on the roster.

I don't agree about Fields. They obviously kept him around to do something with him. They could have traded him at the deadline too.

They must see that they need him around post-Konerko.

**maurice** · 09-01-2009 12:39 PM

Viciedo is the probable candidate to replace Konerko.

If they wanted Fields, they would've left him at 3B when they promoted Bacon. At the very least, they wouldn't have demoted him to the minors for no apparent reason. He got on Ozzie's shitlist somehow, and that's the kiss of death. I think we've seen ample evidence that the death spiral sometimes takes longer than necessary. Borchard languished in the minors until somebody offered a valuable return. BA got to stick around for years because he filled a bench need that the Sox still have. Fields? Not so much.

**Fuller** · 09-01-2009 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by FedEx227

Yup. Exactly.

Your 2010 Chicago White Sox

1B- Konerko
2B- Getz
SS- Ramirez
3B- Beckham
DH- Thome
CF- Rios
LF- Pods
RF- TCQ

At least that's my prediction.

That is utterly depressing. Here is what I would project:

1B- Konerko
2B- Ramirez
SS- Beckham
3B- Figgins/Beltre
RF- TCQ
CF- Rios
LF- Some guy named Moe, or not Pods
DH- Dye

Only problem there is if Some Guy named Moe is not a leadoff hitter and you have Beltre at 3B, then you have a bit of a problem

***Zoso*** · 09-01-2009 12:47 PM

CQ can definitely play right. If they were smart, which they're not, they'd instruct him to lose 15 pounds to keep some weight off his foot.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:47 PM

I still think Viciedo isn't going to help in 2010. He's slugging .380 in Birmingham. That's not impressive at all, let alone at a corner position.

I don't see how the Sox can afford to trade Fields after pissing Brandon Allen away.

**samram** · 09-01-2009 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by maurice

Let me take a step back. KW has been hinting for weeks that the lineup is going to be re-worked if they don't make the playoffs. Well, they ain't gonna make the playoffs. So the question is, which positions get reworked?

Given what we know about KW and Ozzie, the only plausible candidates I see are DH, 2B, and the corner OF spot not occupied by TCQ. Also, assuming that AJ stays, KW is going to want to give Flowers more than backup ABs, which pretty much requires them to stay flexible at DH.

That assumes Beckham doesn't move to 2B, which I think is a good assumption at this point.

We know they have to have a better baseball IQ as a team next year. I think KW and Ozzie know it too. That's why I don't think Pods comes back. You can find a lead off hitter at 2B, whether it's Hudson or Figgins, if they want to spend, or Iwamura if they want to be cheap. Has Freddy Sanchez signed an extension? He has an $8M option and I'm not sure SF picks that up. I think they'll spend some money at this spot and get Figgins or Hudson, if either will leave LA.

They'll need to get someone to hit with some power in the OF. So I could see them signing Cameron to play RF. Great defender. He and Rios make the OF defense 100X better than it is now.

That would still leave them enough to make a mid-range signing for DH if they so chose. I could see Adam LaRoche or Nick Johnson coming in. That also would give them a 1B after PK leaves if they so chose.

samram added 2 Minutes and 25 Seconds later...

So my lineup would be:

1. Figgins/Hudson
2. Beckham
3. Quentin
4. Konerko
5. LaRoche/Johnson
6. Rios
7. AJ
8. Cameron
9. Ramirez

***Zoso*** · 09-01-2009 12:55 PM

Ooh, boy Cameron in right would be nice.

That lineup is weak though. Konerko is not a cleanup hitter anymore and CQ isn't reliable until he proves he is.

***SABRSox*** · 09-01-2009 12:58 PM

My stab:

Pods - LF
Beckham - SS/2B
Quentin - RF
Konerko - 1B
Thome - DH
Rios - CF
AJ - C
Fields - 3B
Ramirez - 2B/SS

I think the Sox will be quiet in the FA market this off-season.

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